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Major "fridge Logic" Moment; see tvtropes.com for definition
Topic Started: Apr 8 2016, 04:35 PM (591 Views)
Xheralt
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Atevi clans are supposed to be, well, clans. Numerous.

Where are the Ragi?

Where is the rest of Tabini-aiji's clan? HIS cousins and uncles? The people entitled BY LINEAGE (and not marriage or official position) to wear red & black. His closest ties seem to be Taibeni, and they remain Taibeni.

Is the entire actual Ragi bloodline down to just Tabini, Cajeiri, and Seimuro? Or is Ragi a "superclan" that encompasses all of the people who speak the language, Padi Valley and Marid alike?
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weeble
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Ragi is a group of clans that speak the Ragi language, live in a certain area and share a culture. I THINK Tabini's clan IS the Taibeni. Remember Cajeiri trying to figure out how he was related to various rangers while they were running around in the woods? There were several cousins there.

There was a reference in one of the early books of the Taiben lands having been made a public trust to help secure the approval of the other Ragi clans for Tabini's line to take over the aijinate. Tabini's line has sort of removed themselves from an active connection with the clan in order to retain the aijinate, and they haven't been very prolific so there are not a lot of spare heirs (uncles and brothers) running around. I know there are references to red and black being Ragi colors, but I suspect its more Taibeni colors, or perhaps just Tabini's line.

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Neco the Nightwraith
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IIRC, Tabini's mother was a Taibeni, and that he was first born.

I thought his father got him first, and then proceeded to produce several other random "spares" from various women who caught his eye, but as far as I know, we haven't heard anything about Tabini's possible half-brothers and -sisters.

I *think* I read this in the short stories.
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jlsjlsjls

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Quote:
 
I *think* I read this in the short stories.


"Deliberations" talks about Valasi's mistresses (he had three at once when he was arranging his marriage), but no mention of any children by them** ... the story also states that the mistresses were considered (with good reason) a threat to both Valasi's wife and to Tabini when he was born.

**Though it's never specifically mentioned in any of the books or short stories, there've been little tidbits (such as Tabini telling Bren that Damiri's second pregnancy was his fault and the overall distinction between sexual partners for fun and for producing children) that have left me with the impression that atevi are far better at birth control/family planning than humans.
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BlueCatShip
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The Ragi are a people sharing a common language and culture, comprising multiple clans across a wide geographic area. The Ragi Western Association is their national territory, roughly speaking, since apparently, atevi have a different idea on nationhood and territory than do humans.

So within the Ragi we have clan affiliations, cultural habits like wearing their hair in braided queues, bicolor clan/house colors for heraldry, ribbons, styles of dress, and so on.

-----

However, IIRC, the Lady Ilisidi is not Ragi, but another related ethnic group, with a different dialect and somewhat different customs. ... Or I need to reread (again).

Then there are the southern coastal group of the Marid, who are a somewhat different group now connected to the Ragi.

The group of clans who were originally on the island (and continental coast?) but were moved out, in order to separate the humans on their island of Mospheira -- Are not Ragi either, and as I recall, have not been too pleased about the move, now over 200 years ago, but as they were not a major group with power in leadership or numbers or economy, they've put up with it, and then have had to deal with partial assimilation to their neighboring peoples, or to remain culturally isolated, with both strains going on within their group.

-- I think I have that correct, from readings of the first three books and the two short stories. But if I've miscontrued something, please do point it out. I feel a lot more confident of my understanding of hani culture than atevi.
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hrhspence
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I think you're spot on, BCS. Ilisidi was Eastern and foreign to the Ragi.
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agricola
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Ilisidi is Eastern and a different language is spoken there (and I would dearly like to find out if it is as number - nuts as Ragi). Also the coastal/former Mospheirans are a different group as well - for one thing, they are very much matriarchal, which Ragi isn't (being more egalitarian apparently) and neither is the east (I think - we don't know enough). The Marid seem to be a bit closer to the Ragi heartland (central/west but more inland).

I remember I think that Lord Geigi is Ragi but his 'lordship' isn't - being mostly coastal.


The tension between the coastal people and the Marid (and the Ragi heartland) seems to be one of the unfinished matters which Ilisidi is bent on 'fixing'.

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Xheralt
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Geigi is himself Maschi (whatever that is), but is nonetheless a "Ragi" lord over an Edi province.

This is part of my point. Everybody else surrounding Tabini is identified as being some other clan. The only other people who ever routinely wear the Ragi red-and-black are Illisidi and Cajeiri. Unless those colors are reserved for aishidi'tat-level aijiin?

It's been noted that clan members are not all Lords, but still occupy useful positions. Shishogi, the Ajuri "old man in the office" is a notable example. The Ragi clan seems to have nothing similar. Of course, occupying the highest office of the land is a pretty commanding advantage, and the other clans compensate for the power inequality by holding such offices.
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