| Welcome to Shejidan. We hope you enjoy your visit. You're currently viewing our forum as a guest. This means you are limited to certain areas of the board and there are some features you can't use. If you join our community, you'll be able to access member-only sections, and use many member-only features such as customizing your profile, sending personal messages, and voting in polls. Registration is simple, fast, and completely free. Join our community! If you're already a member please log in to your account to access all of our features: |
| Is the Compact In The Alliance/Union Universe? | |
|---|---|
| Tweet Topic Started: Feb 2 2015, 10:07 AM (2,310 Views) | |
| hrhspence | Feb 11 2015, 02:48 PM Post #61 |
|
Hani Assassin
![]()
|
I took the Star Wars discussion out of this thread and made a new one in the Quinaltine Steps. |
![]() |
|
| starexplorer | Feb 19 2015, 06:40 AM Post #62 |
|
First Contact Assassin
![]()
|
Jony Ive, Apple's design guru, discussing the transition that occurs when a new beloved product he designed is released:
|
![]() |
|
| BlueCatShip | Feb 19 2015, 03:29 PM Post #63 |
|
Unlabelled Browncoat Scaper
![]()
|
Once something like that goes out into the world, yes, and then "your baby" (and thereby yourself) are subject to the slings and arrows, sticks and stones, of the public's criticisms, pro and con, of your baby. "That baby's ugly!" "That baby's beautiful!" "That baby's...." Heh. Aside: I am not nearly as thrilled with the iOS 8 and Mac OS Yosemite look as I was with the previous look. I also wish they'd allow more user control over font-sizes in the user interface. But on the whole, they do a good job most of the time with interface design and industrial design. However, other companies could become as savvy in that, and give Apple a run for its money. I wish Microsoft were better about its interface, its pricing, and its attitude towards how the user interacts with its software. But that's just me, and is completely aside from the thread topic. Any creative person, whether artist or technical, has to deal with how others perceive "their baby" out in the public. There is also, yes, a sense of ownership, of having a stake in something, such as an interface or a type font, or a product design, or an artwork like a fictional series. Fans especially feel a sense of ownership in the series they love. And in a sense, perhaps they're (we're) right. There's truth to the argument that without that audience support, viewing/listening, buying copies of a series and any marketed tie-ins, that the series wouldn't get to continue and the authors / artists wouldn't get paid to keep working. But from the artist / author side, there's also a sense of not only ownership, but creation. "I made this. I made it so people can enjoy it. But I don't want them dictating to me how I should create it, what content I should put in or leave out, and what happens with it, how I do things, what I create." On the other hand, artists and authors do want to know what their fans / audience / paying patrons want in a series or artwork. An artist or author wants to know his/her work is appreciated and understood and liked/loved for what it is, a validation of what the artist put into it, the effort and the ideas and the work and time, the amount of thought that went into it. The artist/author typically does also want to create things that the audience / fans / patrons want, and not only the artist/author's own preferences for what he/she produces. Then there is also the argument that an artist or author would darn well create their art (music, etc.) even if no one else at all wanted to see/hear or pay for it, because...well, because there is the urge to create, and to create what the artist/author feels led to create, what he or she is inspired to do, to make. It's a very symbiotic interaction, granted. I have, at times, been thrilled when someone has loved work I've done. I've also been, at times, dismayed or hurt if someone really disliked or hated work I'd done. And then there are times when I'm not too bothered one way or another, because either I knew I'd done what I wanted, or what the client wanted, and I didn't feel quite so personally at stake invested in it, whether the reaction was positive or negative or mixed. That's an oddity of the creative process. I may feel very deeply personally at stake, about some thing or other, a whole work or some aspect. Or I may be just as proud of it, feel that I accomplished what I set out to, and feel just as strong a sense of "I made this, it's my work," and yet not take it so personally. I don't know what it is about the creative process that instills that sometimes, and other times, I'm simply satisfied it's done, I said, did, made what I set out to, with it. I tend to think that only certain things do that, and it isn't so often, as one gains experience and perspective, yet it still happens, even with very experienced people. I can relate to the mixed feelings a designer like that has, regarding a project or piece or series, like that. Hah, then there is the very difficult case where the client has no real idea how to express what he/she wants, or worse, has no idea what he/she does want, but expects you, the designer, to figure that out. And...well, figuring that out is indeed the designer's job. I have found that often happens, and it's about as likely that the client will be pleased, as that the client won't like it at all, or will want some changes, but...still cannot articulate what he/she wants. That kind of case is ~very~ frustrating. (I've had the boss from hell and the client from hell at times. Whew. Not a good thing for one's creative powers or one's temper and sense of calm and well-being, lemme tell ya! Heh. But them's the breaks, as they say.) There are so many aspects to the artist-audience relationship, and yes, it's fascinating, trying to figure it all out. Whatever creative process one is involved in, there can be, at some point, that question of the interaction between the creator and the audience / user / fan / patron, of what does the creative person do to meet the wants and needs of the (paying) public, and to fulfill the creative person's own wants and needs, of what to produce and what aesthetics go into it. I can make, for example, many, many different styles of a given thing, and I, as a designer, may greatly enjoy doing those, the variety and the exploration, the research and the creation. The audience, the client or patron, the buying public, fans, users -- may take a liking to one and not the other, or they may want a lot more options on one, or changes on another, to suit them -- or to suit what's currently popular, in fashion. Or, hah, there's always the person who likes the oddball thing, or the chance that something, some new combination, will become popular. That's another part of the artist-audience interaction. -- I can give my best guess of what's marketable, what will sell, what will be beloved by buyers / fans / users (etc.), and yes, I need to be canny enough to guess well at that. I also have to do what I feel led to do. And I have to produce what people like, too, to be successful at it. -- And it can be a surprise and a joy to discover that something's a hit, that it was really liked and loved, by whomever it was created for, whether that was a specific person or group, or whether it was simply, "I think this will be a hit," or "I think this will do it, will meet a need or a desire, or an aesthetic feel." Heh, so very much goes into that, and so much of it is not so tangible. Fashion goes into it. Utility of form and function should go into it. One's own lights as a designer do go into it. But much of it is not quite what one can point at and say, "See, it's that thing there." Usually, it's a set of intangibles that go into it. ... And yes, as a creator, there's also often a sense of, "I'm in the zone, it's just flowing right through me, I'm creating this, but I'm not quite sure where it's all coming from, and yet it's so, so good," that feeling that it created itself. Hard to describe, and yet most creative people (artists or technical) will tell you that despite all their training, talent, education, and hard work, there is that time when it all comes together and what you're creating simply comes together as if it you're the conduit and it's doing itself. And oops, if I don't get a move-on, I'm gonna be late. Cab's due for an appt. soon. :D (But darn it, it's on the spending and paying and obligations side, not the income coming in side.... But that goes with it too.) I will say though, that despite how damnably frustrating it can be at times...I still love the things I do. I knew, going into it, that a liberal arts major is not really the best guarantee of steady, continued, large income (falls over laughing). But...well, dang it, I like this stuff. (The creative stuff. Not the crud that sometimes happens, and not the scrabbling if things get tough. Trying to extricate myself from that. Stuff happens.) But I still like what I do, or I wouldn't do it anymore. I keep doing it, because I would, even if, like now, income is not rolling in. Hah, so much that goes into it all, and so much that defies analysis. (And yet, I'll over-analyze and write like crazy, as has been noted before on several occasions.) :atwink OK, off to see the wizard.... |
![]() |
|
| starexplorer | Feb 19 2015, 04:53 PM Post #64 |
|
First Contact Assassin
![]()
|
The Ive quote was meant as a supporting comment from another area of the creative world for my perspective that we are left with the text but not the author's privileged take on its meaning. |
![]() |
|
| hrhspence | Feb 19 2015, 05:30 PM Post #65 |
|
Hani Assassin
![]()
|
I think this is a great summation of the creative process. As long as the work is in the creator's head it is his alone, but when it's out in the public domain, it's the public's right to say their own interpretation. |
![]() |
|
| BlueCatShip | Feb 19 2015, 06:41 PM Post #66 |
|
Unlabelled Browncoat Scaper
![]()
|
I'm still of two minds on this, StarExplorer, because I see the artist's or author's standpoint as well as the reader's (audience's, fan's) standpoint. I sympathize with both. As a fan, I feel a connection to the work and I (of course) have my own interpretation and opinion on the work. As you say, it takes on its own individual meaning for me as the fan or audience. That includes whatever literary or artistic opinions I have, because of my background with literature and languages, as an editor and writer, and as an artist/designer. Then since I do have that background creating work, I can also see that the author has his/her perspective, opinion, on what he/she has made. You're making the point that the creator's opinion is an individual opinion like that of any other viewer of the work. You also say that once the creator has released that work into the public, the creator doesn't have a privileged viewpoint on it, and certainly not after the work's creator is gone. I agree that each person will have his/her own viewpoint, an opinion on the work, and that's as valid for that person as the next person's opinion is for him/her. I tend to think most authors and artists would understand and defend that idea, probably vehemently. In fact, yes, that's usually what we're taught in literary or art criticism. I'd also say that an artist (or author) very much does want each audience member to have a strong (and favorable, hah) opinion of the work, a liking for it (enough to want more, and pay to see it or own a copy! heh). This is a satisfaction and validation for the artist's creative process, for his/her work to be appreciated, wanted...wanted more of it. But, hmm, I'd also say that an artist or author also insists that he or she has some right to say, "This is what the work means to me, this is what I meant by it, this is what I put into it." The author or artist prefers his/her own interpretation as the work's creator. We as the audience (fans, patrons, critics) are obliged to note that, even if, to us, it has other meanings ... or does not, to us, mean what the author/artist says. (That last, probably to the chagrin of the artist/author, yes.) Heh, the artist/author has copyright too, so he/she has some say in what he/she wants to do with it. Now, whether the artist/author's comments on the work are a measure of how successful the work communicated what it was supposed to, that's another point altogether. But most people (usually including the artist) like to comment and discuss the work, and like to ask questions of the artist while the artist is still available to discuss the work. So...well, I'm still of two minds on it, but I do see what you mean, and the one side of my mind agrees with you, while the other one remains obstinate or unsure, and both sides remain, as usual, voluble. :grin: Your not-always-so-humble and not-always-so-obedient, but nonetheless interested, servant, BCS-ji. :bowing: :rose: |
![]() |
|
| BGrandrath | Feb 19 2015, 11:46 PM Post #67 |
![]()
|
http://m.theatlantic.com/technology/archiv...t-first/385551/ In this thread because it is an on topic serious essay |
![]() |
|
| starexplorer | Feb 20 2015, 08:17 AM Post #68 |
|
First Contact Assassin
![]()
|
Interesting apropos article, BG. Thank you. It seems the author's biggest interest is in a certain naïveté in readers who don't adequately differentiate the work from the experience of it, as seen through tense usages. In discussing the Han Shot First episode his primarily focus also seems more to make a point about fandom, illustrated by the reaction of dedicated and angry devotees, than on the issue of cultural interpretation and reinterpretation per se. Neither Lucas nor the public come off especially well here. Enjoyed reading it! |
![]() |
|
| starexplorer | Feb 25 2015, 08:07 AM Post #69 |
|
First Contact Assassin
![]()
|
Thinking about that article, I realize it should be "Han Shoots First". |
![]() |
|
| Kokipy | Feb 26 2015, 01:22 AM Post #70 |
![]()
|
:cheers2 |
![]() |
|
| BGrandrath | Feb 26 2015, 02:30 AM Post #71 |
![]()
|
Yeah, almost an interesting article but then devolved into a Star Wars trivia debate.....I hate when that happens |
![]() |
|
| 1 user reading this topic (1 Guest and 0 Anonymous) | |
| « Previous Topic · The Cherryh Grove · Next Topic » |













2:33 PM Jul 11